Re: A Diplomatic Thread

[Mado]

I mean what can I say? All I can own up to is the fact that I was unreasonably vulgar and brash in talking to you guys for the recent period and that's not justifiable under any circumstances. I'm very sorry about that.

But when it comes to me holding people to a double standard or acting unfair towards Talon I'm still not convinced that I handled it wrong.

I wasn't the one who stood an obstacle in the face of teamwork and cooperation. Any time a conversation was being held on Nova and some dude who hasn't been around for a couple weeks shows up conveniently at that time to participate I ask you and some others who told them about this and you guys just act like you don't know or ignore me entirely. How can I just keep depending on you to give me real information when some of you are literally working for some kinda gossip network where you put strangers above the chat and can never be transparent with me? If you have something to say about that I'll listen but as it is now it doesn't seem like I'm the one who's responsible for the lack of communication.This isn't out of pride and or because I feel shame in admitting my shortcomings to you guys. I'm just not yet convinced that you guys have the chat's interest in mind with what transpired so far. Getting over the past was something I believed in but thanks to how often you guys slap me with disappointment and prioritize a cheap laugh or some kind of troll association loyalty over Nova I'm just not sure if I can have your word for everything. If you think I'm assuming things with no basis for what's seeming clear with how you guys act at least don't leave me in the dark and tell me the truth of things instead of laughing with zero or whomever.

[charizardf1]

Everytime I try to have a discussion with you you end up running away from the situation you never even give us the chance to explain things to you. There’s nothing wrong with random people jumping in to give their input in a public space. If you’re uncomfortable with that then you can simply just speak to certain individuals in pms or wherever else you feel things will run more smoothly between you and whoever. I’m not sure what strangers you’re talking about but in general literally every one of us are outliers in these predicaments anyways. It’s all about collecting info then gauging from there what to believe going forward. Yes we’ve gone about some things with a cheap laugh upon situations that probably mean a lot more to the main people involved and we wish to fix that.

You however do indeed have a problem with teamwork because it’s always extremely hard for you to work with anyone. Don’t just put all the blame on us because of how we act. You yourself can be very stubborn and problrmatic when people want to address and try to work with you on information. You often for the most part just push people aside so I really don’t think you are a team player it was extremely hard to even get you to even have a simple conversation like this. I don’t believe I’ve been transparent about anything at all. I’ve always just given everything I knew about whatever but I’m called out as if I know more about certain other things or whatever.

Well I can’t really say you assume anything without basis but you do just assume and leave it at that. Whatever you’re using that is a base isn’t where u stop with your judgements. Like I said before you have to go beyond just your collective thoughts because just doing that alone is only setting yourself up for failure which has been a consistent complaint on you time and time again.

I really literally have no reason to hide anything what do I have to hide? What I say is what I know I don’t understand where you get these thoughts that people are hiding something.

[Mado]

Everytime I try to have a discussion with you you end up running away from the situation you never even give us the chance to explain things to you. There’s nothing wrong with random people jumping in to give their input in a public space. If you’re uncomfortable with that then you can simply just speak to certain individuals in pms or wherever else you feel things will run more smoothly between you and whoever. I’m not sure what strangers you’re talking about but in general literally every one of us are outliers in these predicaments anyways. It’s all about collecting info then gauging from there what to believe going forward. Yes we’ve gone about some things with a cheap laugh upon situations that probably mean a lot more to the main people involved and we wish to fix that.

I don't believe showing up to rain their wrath on the person that brought them up in an exaggerated manner that only fits a troll is what I'd call a respectful input, some of you literally just pave the way for your gossip buddies to attack people who dare say the slightest thing about them and I can't really call out a specific person because you guys never want to say who told them to show up on the idea that you'd be selling out if you did.

If it were as simple as pming people to get them to stop we'd never have gotten to this point to begin with. I have tried and it's not as simple as you're trying to make it sound.

You however do indeed have a problem with teamwork because it’s always extremely hard for you to work with anyone. Don’t just put all the blame on us because of how we act. You yourself can be very stubborn and problrmatic when people want to address and try to work with you on information. You often for the most part just push people aside so I really don’t think you are a team player it was extremely hard to even get you to even have a simple conversation like this. I don’t believe I’ve been transparent about anything at all. I’ve always just given everything I knew about whatever but I’m called out as if I know more about certain other things or whatever.

Again, I've only gotten to this point because you guys made me lose faith with how you handle things like when it was that day long debate between Tam and Zero and for some reason you were involved too you were pulling out information about things that I don't know about little by little and were talking to Zero as if you're trying to help him win a court case instead of coming to me directly and laying out your entire knowledge and opinion on the thing so I can have a complete picture from the get go but you preferred to do things your own way in the same way you're criticizing me for. My late negative philosophy towards these things is only a result of things like that and I don't think it's something I should be sorry for.

Well I can’t really say you assume anything without basis but you do just assume and leave it at that. Whatever you’re using that is a base isn’t where u stop with your judgements. Like I said before you have to go beyond just your collective thoughts because just doing that alone is only setting yourself up for failure which has been a consistent complaint on you time and time again.

Had you put aside your whims and self motivated goals in tackling these things I wouldn't have had to investigate things on my own and trust only my judgement and a few others' to be neutral in the time you've displayed bias for parties over and over.

I really literally have no reason to hide anything what do I have to hide? What I say is what I know I don’t understand where you get these thoughts that people are hiding something.

How could I know? All I can do is assume your motivations when you leave me in the dark to please given name and have your way with whomever else.

I'll humble myself 100 times over and take extreme care in listening to you guys thoroughly before judging anything if that's all it took for us to get over these issues but you guys just continue with your sneaky ways, including Tam and how she only let on some stuff when it was too late and some other examples as well, it doesn't give me much room for trust and basically begging you to understand that I'm trying to lend a hand for like 5 years ever seemed to work so all I'm left with is to disregard everything that doesn't come off sound to me from people who don't seem to care much for anything besides their own motivations.

You guys most definitely forced my hand.

[charizardf1]

Hey Nobody is attacking you that’s all in your head we all literally tell you outright that is not the correct context. It is simple to dm a person about things AD recently just did that with Tam you don’t see him acting in public. It’s not my obligation to let you know about a situation that isn’t your problem. The only reason I was with zero and tam was bc it’s their problem and the information needed to be between them. I don’t have to let you know everything about that primarily. I disclosed anything to you upon asked.

I don’t understand how exactly I’m being biased about anything. I’ve always disclosed to my vision and beliefs my own faults and the faults of others both friend and foe alike. I am not on a side. I’ve said things against and for everyone at all corners of this. If you see me as bias it’s simply bc I’m not defending your objective and am not going to hold back situations that are there. So I wish to for you to lay out how exactly have I been biased when I’ve defended your side, spoke against spin, said that this is all our faults. So what I believe is your calling me such just bc I’m not subjecting to your claims.

You keep saying that you’ve been neutral but how you’ve displayed this situation was the farthest from it. You’ve only ever defended your own thoughts and didn’t entertain anybody except the ppl who are in your circle of agreement. I’m not grouped with anyone let me say this again.

Again this isn’t your problem, you’re an outlier. I’m not obligated to prioritize coming to you regarding certain information. If you ask about it or the conversation is brought up upon situation then yeah I’ll give it if necessary but you’re not obligated to everything up front. I have no ulterior motive of hiding things from people and pleasing another. When I know about something I go to the main person about things. You need to remember that you are an admin of a chatroom you’re not our parents or supervisor where I have to let you know things upon every situation. This is why I rarely ever confront you about my personal problems because it’s my issue and not anybody else’s.

I’m in no way being sneaky about anything I’ve always been upfront about everything I really do not care enough to come up with some type of orchestrated plan against people. I literally don’t have time for that.

Stop acting so innocent and trying to push this onto us. These things aren’t happening out of thin air and you have to realize that. You’ve pushed our hand. You’re lucky we’ve had the patience to not address things years ago just for the sake of keeping things together but we reached a breaking point. Things will never move anymore forward until you choose to see your part in why this is happening in the first place.

Nobody has been perfect in handling situations and the only thing we can do is try to improve upon our mistakes. We’ve let a lot slide for far too long as well as failed each other in many aspects. With all that said regardless of the outcome I’m not holding anything against anyone. I have nothing against anybody. However you conclude your thoughts I’ll respect your stance. Nobody’s entitled to follow anyone’s outlook on things and I’m not here to force anything. Only attempt to inform. So...yeah I’m not sure I have much more to follow up with. I’ll respond to whatever else people have to say.

[Punkin]

You & Tam both have a point that I really do seem to go back on my words. We've done this before where I apologize & have seen the value in my friendship with you over my pride in my beliefs that I held onto so firmly before I took into consideration what other people had to say on the matter & what the bigger picture is. All I can do now, Mado, is try my hardest to keep that in my perspective. I don't exactly know what the root of that is, but it is a pattern & for one reason or another that does happen. There isn't justification for it. I honestly didn't even know I did that until you mentioned it just now.

In recent times, however, Mado, I shared a very sensitive & personal subject with you & my other friends at Nova. I shared what happened with Pitou over the last 3 years, & I shared the beginning of my HRT/gender affirmation process. In both times, I was met with harsh criticism, negativity, & a general lack of support. Again, I hadn't handled coming out with what I did about Pitou properly, but I did NOT lie. I, in my then emotional state portrayed him as a much less humanized version of his real self, but what happened between him & myself was completely unacceptable. 

Though I now don't see this to be as harsh as I once thought it was, when I came to you personally about this, you told me I had made a mistake. That "we all make mistakes". I was hurt by this & felt like you didn't respect me enough to believe what I had told you; you didn't believe me. I left & when I came to possibly reacquaint, I was called a liar, called manipulative, & completely shut out of any input whatsoever. I handled it wrong & I can understand the recoil I got, but even from the beginning, none of you seemed to quite understand the sensitivity of the subject to me or what it means for the environment of Novastorm.

I was called a "tranny", a "slut", told so many things that were just fueled by pure rage. Just what kind of person do you think cannot be impacted by reading these things from people I call "friends"? Much less people who say they don't condone acts of discrimination. Nova has a long history of contradicting it's standpoint on being inclusive to people of many backgrounds. Just what kind of place do you think it is when someone who is beginning HRT & experiences gender dysphoria is told they aren't "really trans", or that they're mentally ill?

Tam's response was "Why didn't you share the cat dick" or something; which was funny, but a sad reminder that for a long time she has kept me at an arm's length & didn't even feel impacted at all to learn that I was unfaithful to her even after I felt so strongly about her & Felt, Jams, & Jess. I met Pitou before Tam had come back from her own year long hiatus as I've said many times, though. Ever since I refused to dislike Char for his rude comments about Tam & the way he had messed with Tam before, she's been convinced that I'm a liability to her mental state.

It's true that I haven't been considerate about how things I think I can't control impact Tam. We actually talked about this some time ago & I then realized what my role has to be in a mutually beneficial relationship with Tam. I have to be there consistently & do right by her to ensure that she's okay. I want more than anything to accept that role, but to be that person there has to be compromises. I'm human -- I make mistakes & I can't be perfect. I can only try to learn & improve.

I won't always have the most shrewd judgment from the beginning, but you can ALWAYS count on me to consider the things that you guys say & try to learn from it because I value you, your input, & our friendship. Doesn't that sound worth it? Isn't it worth it for us to learn more about how we all feel & learn how to be better for our friends & even ourselves?

[Mado]

It's probably pointless to continue trying to find who's really to blame for where we are now, I'll just go ahead and apologize for each instance each of you found me to be handling something unfairly or in favor of one side.

You seem serious enough about this even though Talon still carries on that attitude of "not invested, don't care" so I'll agree to come to a middle ground of mutual trust so please don't ever do something selfish and keep in mind what you proposed here, I'll be remembering it and of course I'll be making my own effort to do the same.

[Mado]

You & Tam both have a point that I really do seem to go back on my words. We've done this before where I apologize & have seen the value in my friendship with you over my pride in my beliefs that I held onto so firmly before I took into consideration what other people had to say on the matter & what the bigger picture is. All I can do now, Mado, is try my hardest to keep that in my perspective. I don't exactly know what the root of that is, but it is a pattern & for one reason or another that does happen. There isn't justification for it. I honestly didn't even know I did that until you mentioned it just now.

In recent times, however, Mado, I shared a very sensitive & personal subject with you & my other friends at Nova. I shared what happened with Pitou over the last 3 years, & I shared the beginning of my HRT/gender affirmation process. In both times, I was met with harsh criticism, negativity, & a general lack of support. Again, I hadn't handled coming out with what I did about Pitou properly, but I did NOT lie. I, in my then emotional state portrayed him as a much less humanized version of his real self, but what happened between him & myself was completely unacceptable. 

Though I now don't see this to be as harsh as I once thought it was, when I came to you personally about this, you told me I had made a mistake. That "we all make mistakes". I was hurt by this & felt like you didn't respect me enough to believe what I had told you; you didn't believe me. I left & when I came to possibly reacquaint, I was called a liar, called manipulative, & completely shut out of any input whatsoever. I handled it wrong & I can understand the recoil I got, but even from the beginning, none of you seemed to quite understand the sensitivity of the subject to me or what it means for the environment of Novastorm.

I was called a "tranny", a "slut", told so many things that were just fueled by pure rage. Just what kind of person do you think cannot be impacted by reading these things from people I call "friends"? Much less people who say they don't condone acts of discrimination. Nova has a long history of contradicting it's standpoint on being inclusive to people of many backgrounds. Just what kind of place do you think it is when someone who is beginning HRT & experiences gender dysphoria is told they aren't "really trans", or that they're mentally ill?

Tam's response was "Why didn't you share the cat dick" or something; which was funny, but a sad reminder that for a long time she has kept me at an arm's length & didn't even feel impacted at all to learn that I was unfaithful to her even after I felt so strongly about her & Felt, Jams, & Jess. I met Pitou before Tam had come back from her own year long hiatus as I've said many times, though. Ever since I refused to dislike Char for his rude comments about Tam & the way he had messed with Tam before, she's been convinced that I'm a liability to her mental state.

It's true that I haven't been considerate about how things I think I can't control impact Tam. We actually talked about this some time ago & I then realized what my role has to be in a mutually beneficial relationship with Tam. I have to be there consistently & do right by her to ensure that she's okay. I want more than anything to accept that role, but to be that person there has to be compromises. I'm human -- I make mistakes & I can't be perfect. I can only try to learn & improve.

I won't always have the most shrewd judgment from the beginning, but you can ALWAYS count on me to consider the things that you guys say & try to learn from it because I value you, your input, & our friendship. Doesn't that sound worth it? Isn't it worth it for us to learn more about how we all feel & learn how to be better for our friends & even ourselves?

When it comes to the HRT thing my disapproval for it just comes from the fact that I don't think it's beneficial for you, I can't act like something will do good for you when I don't believe so in my mind, I did at least tell you that I'll support whichever decision you make and won't mock you a second for taking HRT therapy. I can't persuade others to be less blunt about how they view your choice or your character after that decision.

If you think the subject of your relationship with him didn't appear important enough to me I'll just let you know that I lost a couple nights of sleep thinking of what would be the right thing to do while you were thinking about how angry you were that I didn't immediately comply and turn my idea of him 180 degrees just based on the fact that you told me he's actually a predator and not a person we could afford to have around expecting me to just discard a person I spent much time trying to establish a friendship with just as it came to fruition.

You've done it, I'll bite. You're sounding sincere enough with your words but really Spin, this is not a threat or anything meant to invoke fear of messing up in you but I don't think I can take another full turn on me. Please make this one count and don't make me more regretful than this time cause I'm really at the peak of it.

[charizardf1]

We’re all to blame for this. We’ve had an unhealthy community for the longest time but we never realized it. It built up to this point where it’s hard to figure out how to do things right.

[Punkin]

You & Tam both have a point that I really do seem to go back on my words. We've done this before where I apologize & have seen the value in my friendship with you over my pride in my beliefs that I held onto so firmly before I took into consideration what other people had to say on the matter & what the bigger picture is. All I can do now, Mado, is try my hardest to keep that in my perspective. I don't exactly know what the root of that is, but it is a pattern & for one reason or another that does happen. There isn't justification for it. I honestly didn't even know I did that until you mentioned it just now.

In recent times, however, Mado, I shared a very sensitive & personal subject with you & my other friends at Nova. I shared what happened with Pitou over the last 3 years, & I shared the beginning of my HRT/gender affirmation process. In both times, I was met with harsh criticism, negativity, & a general lack of support. Again, I hadn't handled coming out with what I did about Pitou properly, but I did NOT lie. I, in my then emotional state portrayed him as a much less humanized version of his real self, but what happened between him & myself was completely unacceptable. 

Though I now don't see this to be as harsh as I once thought it was, when I came to you personally about this, you told me I had made a mistake. That "we all make mistakes". I was hurt by this & felt like you didn't respect me enough to believe what I had told you; you didn't believe me. I left & when I came to possibly reacquaint, I was called a liar, called manipulative, & completely shut out of any input whatsoever. I handled it wrong & I can understand the recoil I got, but even from the beginning, none of you seemed to quite understand the sensitivity of the subject to me or what it means for the environment of Novastorm.

I was called a "tranny", a "slut", told so many things that were just fueled by pure rage. Just what kind of person do you think cannot be impacted by reading these things from people I call "friends"? Much less people who say they don't condone acts of discrimination. Nova has a long history of contradicting it's standpoint on being inclusive to people of many backgrounds. Just what kind of place do you think it is when someone who is beginning HRT & experiences gender dysphoria is told they aren't "really trans", or that they're mentally ill?

Tam's response was "Why didn't you share the cat dick" or something; which was funny, but a sad reminder that for a long time she has kept me at an arm's length & didn't even feel impacted at all to learn that I was unfaithful to her even after I felt so strongly about her & Felt, Jams, & Jess. I met Pitou before Tam had come back from her own year long hiatus as I've said many times, though. Ever since I refused to dislike Char for his rude comments about Tam & the way he had messed with Tam before, she's been convinced that I'm a liability to her mental state.

It's true that I haven't been considerate about how things I think I can't control impact Tam. We actually talked about this some time ago & I then realized what my role has to be in a mutually beneficial relationship with Tam. I have to be there consistently & do right by her to ensure that she's okay. I want more than anything to accept that role, but to be that person there has to be compromises. I'm human -- I make mistakes & I can't be perfect. I can only try to learn & improve.

I won't always have the most shrewd judgment from the beginning, but you can ALWAYS count on me to consider the things that you guys say & try to learn from it because I value you, your input, & our friendship. Doesn't that sound worth it? Isn't it worth it for us to learn more about how we all feel & learn how to be better for our friends & even ourselves?

When it comes to the HRT thing my disapproval for it just comes from the fact that I don't think it's beneficial for you, I can't act like something will do good for you when I don't believe so in my mind, I did at least tell you that I'll support whichever decision you make and won't mock you a second for taking HRT therapy. I can't persuade others to be less blunt about how they view your choice or your character after that decision.

If you think the subject of your relationship with him didn't appear important enough to me I'll just let you know that I lost a couple nights of sleep thinking of what would be the right thing to do while you were thinking about how angry you were that I didn't immediately comply and turn my idea of him 180 degrees just based on the fact that you told me he's actually a predator and not a person we could afford to have around expecting me to just discard a person I spent much time trying to establish a friendship with just as it came to fruition.

You've done it, I'll bite. You're sounding sincere enough with your words but really Spin, this is not a threat or anything meant to invoke fear of messing up in you but I don't think I can take another full turn on me. Please make this one count and don't make me more regretful than this time cause I'm really at the peak of it.

It's necessarily the "disapproval" -- it's the active volatile comments that were made that were fueled by the disapproval. They weren't acceptable or necessary if you really believe that people had ought to belong without fear of discrimination or hate for who they are in ways they cannot control. I didn't choose to experience the things I have with dysphoria & to be scuffed by the people I call friends for my decision that I have decided will positively impact my life was just wrong no matter how you look at it. 

I made immature decisions based off of my emotional response to that; which I do confess. But at every step of the way you have denied & justified the things that have been said or done to me because of how poorly I handled this one situation that I have now learned from & that was an extremely sensitive topic to me at the time. 

I don't feel like you genuinely believe you, Tam, or Kris have had an impact in this, but you did & it feels like you are unwilling to accept that I reacted poorly to an already volatile setting. I can't decide for you how to show sincerity or regret, but it really seems to a lot of people that you don't regret what you've said or done & that you've just solidified yourself in your own conclusion to the matter instead of completing the picture by listening to others & considering how your actions played a larger part overall. 

This isn't a competition of who was more right or wrong. I'm not bringing these things up because I think you are more to blame for anything than myself. I want you to genuinely see the bigger picture & understand not only how you, Tam, or Kris feels, but consider that I too am human & how I felt at all stages of what's happened. Consider that I put so much of my heart into persuading you that I care. 

I could play Yugioh with anybody, I could play Pokemon with anybody, I could chat with any group; but I love YOU guys because I have learned so much from you & I genuinely have such a high admiration for the honorable characteristics you've put on full display at times where I myself was weak. Times where I needed to be humble, shut up, & listen. 

I don't command you to listen, but I beg that you look within yourself for faults to find humanity in me. Please for the sake of love have faith in me & my intentions. Do you remember every time I was called manipulative? And I asked you what I do that is manipulative; or what I want from any of you that is so wrong? 

You yourself at one point admitted that you just don't have answer. Please for once try to believe that you were wrong & that I'm just a person who had foresaken you for faults in myself. Because I was hurt, Mado. I was in pain. Even now I lament every day over this.

[Tamicat]

@Charizardf1

You might not wanna hear it from me char but you've actively done things against your friends wishes just because you're bored or wanted more drama at Nova. In the time I've been at nova I think that's the biggest thing that curved mado's opinion of "Sensei is so wise" to "I have to babysit this guy acting like a child" - Your words would probably have a lot more impact if you weren't embracing this persona of a troublemaker regardless of the grief and drama it caused for everyone around you for years now. There was a period you even praised me once if I recall for being such a powder keg of trouble since you thought that Nova was boring without these every day fights.

You guys say Mado isn't taking responsibility for his own mistakes but I think he's been pretty clear he feels he's done no wrong. You want him to admit he's wrong but you're also probably more stubborn than he is from what I see and don't want to admit you're wrong in any meaningful way. A big issue I have with Spin is that he had a chance to fix all this but chose not to and now it's hard to imagine a world where he CAN fix it. The only thing he can think of using someone like Yiffy to get my attention or alt accounts to avoid me blocking him. So much of it feels disingenuous like your words don't match lunastorm member actions.

You're the same group who called me SJW tumblr trash for years but now I'm too edgy in my opinions on things to be on the politically correct. I don't think I've changed in this way but rather you guys have flip flopped to another extreme stance like it's a trend.

I dunno, it's not really like you to double down on things so much just to side with one group. Usually you're just kinda contrarian or doing your own thing arbitrarily.

I think quite a few people beyond just me have a "We're better off without them attitude" because they view it as a petty power grab. I'm not trying to paint AD as anything in specific so much as I just say what I think of people. I'm pretty sure AD is a lot more at odds with other people because of his BLM we have to mind our language stance that he has kinda passed on to many others. I've never really heard even one person agree with me on a harsh stance I've taken against AD because he's pretty well liked or if he's not liked it's by people for completely different reasons.

I think I've been more than fair about Zero. I stand by what I said and probably could've said a lot more but held back for the sake of peace for a long time now. I'm never gonna budge on that, he's not just a whacky troll with good intentions in my eyes. He's a genuinely horrible person from every experience I've had with him and he does more than just poke at people for fun.

It's actually a little sad to see Mado take this stance of "I hope it's not just bravado and you guys stick to your guns" because many like you or talon are just as Nova as ever even if I don't like it. Even dumbos like Drago get sad you seem to be gone. Maybe it's just something that has to happen now that it's gone this far.

[Mado]

The volatile parts, while they were rude and unneeded nonetheless were not for the fact that I've given up on you for your decision. I was just coming back at you for saying things I felt were equally wounding. I had started to get weary at that point of how it seemed as though all you think about is what you want and how you feel with little regard to others.

I don't like to come off like I'm avoiding accountability and I'm pretty sure I did mess up and go way over the top about many things in the exchanges we had but one thing for sure is that I didn't randomly choose to start attacking and yearn for your misery. I was thinking you guys would know that it kinda takes much to get me to be offensive to this extent from the time you've known but I guess all it looks like to you is that I wanted to listen to things in my head and be awful with everybody else out of nowhere.

It's very possible that I've misjudged you and that you didn't bear ill intentions like that but at that point it really didn't matter to me because I felt like I was getting nowhere trying with you and you'll repeat the same things that make me feel terrible as many times as things can go against your liking. If you understand what it's like acting in a way that opposes your sound judgement and moral incentive, you could probably why I'm acting this way towards you too.

[charizardf1]

@Charizardf1

You might not wanna hear it from me char but you've actively done things against your friends wishes just because you're bored or wanted more drama at Nova. In the time I've been at nova I think that's the biggest thing that curved mado's opinion of "Sensei is so wise" to "I have to babysit this guy acting like a child" - Your words would probably have a lot more impact if you weren't embracing this persona of a troublemaker regardless of the grief and drama it caused for everyone around you for years now. There was a period you even praised me once if I recall for being such a powder keg of trouble since you thought that Nova was boring without these every day fights.

You guys say Mado isn't taking responsibility for his own mistakes but I think he's been pretty clear he feels he's done no wrong. You want him to admit he's wrong but you're also probably more stubborn than he is from what I see and don't want to admit you're wrong in any meaningful way. A big issue I have with Spin is that he had a chance to fix all this but chose not to and now it's hard to imagine a world where he CAN fix it. The only thing he can think of using someone like Yiffy to get my attention or alt accounts to avoid me blocking him. So much of it feels disingenuous like your words don't match lunastorm member actions.

You're the same group who called me SJW tumblr trash for years but now I'm too edgy in my opinions on things to be on the politically correct. I don't think I've changed in this way but rather you guys have flip flopped to another extreme stance like it's a trend.

I dunno, it's not really like you to double down on things so much just to side with one group. Usually you're just kinda contrarian or doing your own thing arbitrarily.

I think quite a few people beyond just me have a "We're better off without them attitude" because they view it as a petty power grab. I'm not trying to paint AD as anything in specific so much as I just say what I think of people. I'm pretty sure AD is a lot more at odds with other people because of his BLM we have to mind our language stance that he has kinda passed on to many others. I've never really heard even one person agree with me on a harsh stance I've taken against AD because he's pretty well liked or if he's not liked it's by people for completely different reasons.

I think I've been more than fair about Zero. I stand by what I said and probably could've said a lot more but held back for the sake of peace for a long time now. I'm never gonna budge on that, he's not just a whacky troll with good intentions in my eyes. He's a genuinely horrible person from every experience I've had with him and he does more than just poke at people for fun.

It's actually a little sad to see Mado take this stance of "I hope it's not just bravado and you guys stick to your guns" because many like you or talon are just as Nova as ever even if I don't like it. Even dumbos like Drago get sad you seem to be gone. Maybe it's just something that has to happen now that it's gone this far.

I'm going to keep it brief with you to be honestly honest. After reading a lot of what you're saying it just feels like i have to repeat myself again. The answers and debunking of some of the things you are saying is in previous posts as well as in other forum posts of the past. I'm just going to accept that if things aren't going to process in the perfect way you want it to be then things will never move anywhere with you so I'm kind of done trying to convince you of things. It's like your brain just doesn't register sentences if it isn't the way you're brain wants it to be constructed. 

Everything I've done I've already addressed in the past as well as acknowledged so you can't use that against me. I have always had the ability to stick to being some saintly role figure but I didn't want to be that. I am on the internet as an escape and all I've wanted is to stay silly and meme while I'm away from reality. I understand that I go too far with it but i just roll with it because i don't see what i do to have any type of long term effects on anyone. Somebody could get upset then just forget it or move on afterwards. You're probably literally the only person who takes such little problems and explodes them into a huge chaotic mess. I know I'm responsible for starting you off but afterwards it's just your imagination running rampant. 

please read back as i stating directly to you before that we are not a group set on rules and regulations I'm an individual in this so I'm not a part of whatever SJW whatever you're talking about. I don't care for any type of power grab if i wanted that I would still be in Nova. Even if Mado was to accept and understand our place in this and decides to change I still don't wish to return at all at least not for awhile. The point of this is to reach a mutual understanding and rebuild things that have been crumbling. I really don't care what whoever is saying these things are saying they most likely are people i don't really associate much with anyways so they can think whatever they wish doesn't matter to me.

You're not fair towards Zero at all. If you dislike him cool i don't care but you like to go above and beyond and be so petty towards him for no reason. Attacking his status just because you have your personal grudge. You can hate him for how he is as a person that's fine never said that's wrong at all but just keep it at that and don't say/do anything that's unnecessary. 

I'm really caring less and less about trying to make sense of the things you say/do. It's been so long and the most progress you allow things to go is an inch when it comes to trying to reach an understanding. My patience with you really is at its peak and I feel like it would be useless to respond to anything you have to say anymore without me having to repeat and explain what is already in your face. All you ever want to do and will continue to ever do is just do your best to paint opposing people as the bad guys you don't seek resolution at all. 

Despite all this though I'm not going to completely hold anything against you due to the fact you operate differently than other people. I'm moreso disappointed in the chat for being too scared to be more honest and upfront with you and conditioned you to think how you think is compeltely viable and ok.

[Tamicat]

Zero attacks my status all the time because of his personal grudge against me. He instigated the whole thing to begin with and broke the deal that was supposed to end it. Technically he should've been permabanned for that as per our agreement to move past it was meant to. I've been more than fair not demanding that even though he's made no effort to change. The only reason I even kinda cared is because some of his friends were people I didn't mind and I didn't want to make things worse than they already were on that front. To put it into perspective he was willing to tank a permaban from nova just for some gossip about me and spin and to push my buttons and that's just a fact you can't deny or say didn't happen.

Zero has never offered or done ANYTHING for me in return or been even kinda fair. Every criticism you have of me can be applied to him twice over that's why I think it's hypocritical to defend him with that logic. I mean afterall he's made no effort to de-escalate any of it and definitely gone out of his way to mess up my friendships with people. You can say the stalking thing can't be proven or whatever or the DMs or the fact he sat in my chat all day just to bother me or whatever else you wanna deny but even at a very surface level he has acted the same as me if not worse. A few times he's made some heartfelt statements like "I'm sorry if me messing with caused any real harm or grief tam, I didn't mean for that and I'll leave u alone in the future" or w/e but he also has gone back on all of those within a weeks time or less every single time.

I really doubt he has much nice to say about me either. It's completely fair in my eyes I don't have to pretend he's a good guy when he's not or that he deserves anything from me. He got a free pass from most of the community for being a legacy member here and his friends don't want to get involved because they've all known each other for years. I get that but I don't need to respect it or tip toe around it either. He's your friend not mine and you can take responsibility for what he does if you wanna defend him more than he's willing to defend himself. You've raised more points in his defense than he ever has, he just goes LMAO and leaves to fuck around with something else because it's kind of just a meme for him.

but again - we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. You wanna believe what you wanna believe about him and I feel the same way about people like Yiffy who you let Spin convince you is a pedophile now. So I guess as time went on I see more where you're coming from but I have no reason to change my mind about Zero. This wasn't supposed to be an in depth discussion of his character anyway. Have you ever told Zero to leave well enough alone like you expect of me? I sorta doubt it.

tl;dr I think he's a bad guy and I got reasons for feeling the way I do. You can't just invalidate them because you don't like the way I think or tell me how to feel about it. I also don't like how often people wanna tell me I'm just exaggerating or how they try to gaslight me into "well you probably just don't remember.... you have mental issues afterall" kind of statements.
---
I'll consider you're not a group but you should consider how things appear. Many of the people who held the opinions I mentioned weren't just link or Mado but rather friends of yours you dealt with for years. I don't really wanna call them out by name but these are sentiments that were said publicly a few times now by regulars who still come to nova. The power grab impression of people like Talon didn't come from me. I guess there's nothing wrong with being part of lunastorm or w/e but you are kinda drawing your line in the sand and picking a side here char.

I've heard a few people call it an outright betrayal trying to steal members and start a community where they have the power instead. I think that might be a little extreme since it is just another chat but regardless that's how some people view it and I can kinda understand why they might feel that way. It's how some of them view places like force too.

You can say you're an individual unrelated to it but I really don't think that's how it comes off to others. I mean aren't you at this "negotiation table" on behalf of that side?

As for being tired of dealing with me I don't really have much to say about that but I'm sure you understand the feeling is mutual. You make no sense to me sometimes and rarely do you give me even an inch yourself. I'm aware I don't budge much but you can't sit there and act like you are any different in that regard char. I don't really know about people being too scared to tell me what they really think either, that's never the impression I got. Mado is kinda polite to everyone but he's called me a literal retard sometimes when I'm being unwilling to cooperate and Mitch has never seemed scared to just tell me what he thinks of me. Maybe Link skirts around his true feelings a bit? I'm not sure. I really feel like people are pretty brutally harsh with me most of the time. You always act like I'm some princess that just gets her way but from my view I rarely get what I want.

I wonder if you've ever sat and actually thought about why I come here or what I want either. You never really consider why I'm so against this idea that drama keeps chat alive or that I hate this kind of thing. I don't revel in it like you seem to think I do. I might have trouble letting stuff go when I feel wronged but fighting and things like this are never why I've wanted to be a part of things. It just makes me feel ostracized or autistic for not understanding the fun in this.

[charizardf1]

Zero attacks my status all the time because of his personal grudge against me. He instigated the whole thing to begin with and broke the deal that was supposed to end it. Technically he should've been permabanned for that as per our agreement to move past it was meant to. I've been more than fair not demanding that even though he's made no effort to change. The only reason I even kinda cared is because some of his friends were people I didn't mind and I didn't want to make things worse than they already were on that front.

Zero has never offered or done ANYTHING for me in return or been even kinda fair. Every criticism you have of me can be applied to him twice over that's why I think it's hypocritical to defend him with that logic. I mean afterall he's made no effort to de-escalate any of it and definitely gone out of his way to mess up my friendships with people. You can say the stalking thing can't be proven or whatever or the DMs or the fact he sat in my chat all day just to bother me or whatever else you wanna deny but even at a very surface level he has acted the same as me if not worse.

I really doubt he has much nice to say about me either. It's completely fair in my eyes I don't have to pretend he's a good guy when he's not or that he deserves anything from me. He got a free pass from most of the community for being a legacy member here and his friends don't want to get involved because they've all known each other for years. I get that but I don't need to respect it or tip toe around it either. He's your friend not mine and you can take responsibility for what he does if you wanna defend him more than he's willing to defend himself. You've raised more points in his defense than he ever has, he just goes LMAO and leaves to fuck around with something else because it's kind of just a meme for him.

but again - we're not gonna see eye to eye on this. You wanna believe what you wanna believe about him and I feel the same way about people like Yiffy who you let Spin convince you is a pedophile now. So I guess as time went on I see more where you're coming from but I have no reason to change my mind about Zero. This wasn't supposed to be an in depth discussion of his character anyway.

tl;dr I think he's a bad guy and I got reasons for feeling the way I do. You can't just invalidate them because you don't like the way I think or tell me how to feel about it. I also don't like how often people wanna tell me I'm just exaggerating or how they try to gaslight me into "well you probably just don't remember.... you have mental issues afterall" kind of statements.
---
I'll consider you're not a group but you should consider how things appear. Many of the people who held the opinions I mentioned weren't just link or Mado but rather friends of yours you dealt with for years. I don't really wanna call them out by name but these are sentiments that were said publicly a few times now by regulars who still come to nova. The power grab impression of people like Talon didn't come from me. I guess there's nothing wrong with being part of lunastorm or w/e but you are kinda drawing your line in the sand and picking a side here char.

I've heard a few people call it an outright betrayal trying to steal members and start a community where they have the power instead. I think that might be a little extreme since it is just another chat but regardless that's how some people view it and I can kinda understand why they might feel that way. It's how some of them view places like force too.

You can say you're an individual unrelated to it but I really don't think that's how it comes off to others. I mean aren't you at this "negotiation table" on behalf of that side?

Zero is barely even around and when he is from  my vision you initiate conflict almost every time. After the time he did you wrong all he seems to ever open with with you is a hello and how you are doing and such then you spazz out and start going off on him which triggers the reaction to troll you. Not trying to say how Zero claps back is justified but you only bring it upon yourself when you do things like that. Outside of Nova i extremely highly doubt he rarely ever even thinks of you. All Zero had to simply do is apologize about that initial situation which he did so. But again i'm not even targeting your overall view upon him I don't really care about that. The ONLY thing that's really messed up is how you go above and beyond on him I could care less how you view him. 

It's really laughable how much you discard and/or not pay any attention to the details upon this entire scenario. I never once said yiffy was a pedophile as well as confirmed upon multiple occasions this very thing(if you don't want to take it from me take it from Mado who I have also had to repeat my stance on multiple occasions). I'm not even going to explain this over again because it will be in void so just ask Mado or Mitch maybe you'll actually pay attention to him. It's definitely understandable for people to think we are in some type of gang gang group from an outside viewpoint so I can't really complain about that. Again I've picked no side i'm not with Spin at all I havn't even completely followed his course of action in this. 

Not sure why people think Luna is trying to steal people. Even if we bring people over it's not like we're all like "hey stay away from nova or else" even talon still goes to nova kind of regularly but ig it is a thing to also consider that people would think but again I kind of really don't care much for how a lot of the irrelevant people think on this. I'm at this table for myself the war thing is a meme unless if you want to think of it in the classic rpg kind of thing where people form a party with different individual objectives to reach a mutual goal sort of thing. Regardless though I can acknowledge the outsider views and such their opinions on this also can be slightly effective but unless they are really in the nitty gritty of this situation overall their words have super low weight to them for me to really care.

[charizardf1]

This is all we'll ever be Tamantha

[Tamicat]

hmph

[Punkin]

"I was just coming back at you for saying things I felt were equally wounding."

Mado. All of yesterday morning I spent trying to get you to understand something & in the end you brushed it off as me talking about me & how I feel. You have spent this entire thread that YOU AGREED TO; deflecting, & once again denying everything there is to be said about you from other people. 

This thread began because you told me you wanted to hear what criticisms people have of you & even YOU went back on YOUR word. 

"I just don't feel like I should actually listen to what x has to say about me" ????? 
You really have turned yourself into this person who thinks they're better than other people & so you don't have to listen to any of what they say

I was quite clear yesterday in articulating my own emotional state at the time things really went downhill FOR YOUR SAKE. Because YOU need a more realistic idea of what happened instead of painting a 2d image of me so that you can continue to fantasize that I was the nightmare goblin causing all of the bad guy things to happen.

I'm not a fucking anime villain manipulating people into getting what I want by backstabbing friends & if that wasn't obvious enough by all of the emotional turmoil this has caused & me reaching out to you by my own volition trying so hard to just see eye to eye with you, then it should be obvious by what is right before you in the fact that you have never once reached out to me, taken any accountability, felt remorseful for what you've said or done, or compromised even with the people who aren't me but are now around me. 

At absolutely every single step of the way you have been the one who doesn't think they could have done anything better & you have been the one who has refused to question their own judgment & yet you're the person who has made empty claims saying other people are gaslighting you because they want you to listen to them for just ONCE.

You have forsaken our friendship, you have denied you were ever wrong about me, you have told lies about me, & you have been completely unwilling to even once step outside of your own point of view for the sake of humanizing me & trying to understand.

Yesterday you called me selfish for making the point that I acted immaturely out of an emotional response that I have since learned from & tried to make you understand so that you can stop creating motives & intentions instead of fucking LISTENING & trying to understand. Yet, all you have had to say when other people are telling you specifically what you have done to contribute to this & how it affected them, you deny them.

How can it be that you & Tam so consistently put yourself above others & you are the ones calling people self-centered? Do you see the inherent hypocrisy in this?

(Edit: Also, I have no faith that you will actually read this & try to understand it because you're just going to do what you always do & deny all of what I just said in this post even though I did not tell one single lie, create any false narratives, or bar any accountability from anyone. If that's the case, then maybe one day you'll learn how to value other people's input even if one single bit through going through life & seeing for yourself what happens when you take no accountability & deny any criticism. I never gave up; you did. You were the one who didn't want to understand, didn't want to try, & didn't take responsibility. I can't force you to do that)

[Mado]

Calling you an anime villain would be a huge overstatement and much more than you deserve.

You say you learned something and grew as a person compared to many months back but you're doing the same acknowledge my pain and admit that you hurt me or I'll pout and run from home.

If you were really hoping to fix things you wouldn't be coming at us with those tears and "you've forsaken me, look how much I'm hurting", that's manipulation in my book and you could babble about it for a hundred years and I won't see it any other way.

If you wanted to have the slightest chance to fixing your romance with Tam you would've thought about what she wanted from you and took a more relaxed approach than putting her on the spot literally every time you visit for half a day to make everybody's mood shit and then piss off to wherever again.

You won't have things your way like this, not a chance in hell. Telling people how much of a victim you are just makes them not wanna budge me included.

I'm done listening to your tragic ceremonies, if you wanna be friends again just fucking stop talking about that shit and come to play videogames. Also tell Tam how you feel in PMs and if she doesn't care tough shit, man. Don't use your desperate desire to date her as an excuse to make the chat an unfavorable place for her because of all your noise.

I won't read shit ever from you again, I'll only look at action and attitude and if you don't like it please get out of my life forever.

[charizardf1]

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